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 Parry as a primary skill...

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Jaq



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Join date : 2015-10-25

PostSubject: Parry as a primary skill...   Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:25 am

Heya

I've read up on the new enhanced skills on the module. If you use Parry every parried attack is countered by a +200% attack, wauv! But will it be enough to out-weigh the downsides of NWN parry:

You're limited to parrying a maximum of three attacks from a single foe per round. That means if an enemy gets four or more attacks, some of them completely bypass your parry ability regardless of how good it is. Parry quickly becomes useless past this point.

Parry functions decently in one-on-one fights for 1st level characters who invest in both the improved parry and skill focus (parry) feats. However, the ability is still useless outside of one-on-one fights, against spellcasters, against ranged attackers, or against enemies who have a way to attack more quickly (ie, anything dual-wielding). It also becomes less and less effective as you gain levels.

To top it off, parry is a dexterity-based skill and subject to armor check penalty. If you wear heavy armor, your parry ability will suffer such huge penalties as to be completely non-functional. This means you have to wear leather armor, which will render you exceedingly vulnerable any time your parry fails.

The bottom line is that parry requires a lot of dedication to get it to function correctly, is ineffective in a wide variety of situations, the math only works for low-level characters, and at its best is comparable to just wearing a suit of good armor. It's a cool idea in theory, but in practice it really stinks.

But, still try it out yourself, and write your most fun/annoying moments in pvp/boss-figthing in this thread and let us know if it worked out for you Smile

Cheers,
Jaq
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Highv Priest
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PostSubject: Re: Parry as a primary skill...   Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:57 pm

There is actually a +7 leather armor.. The highest AC total armor in the game actually. Additionally while you cannot block all attacks concealment is still a thing and AC is a thing too.

Epic Dodge is also a thing.

Parry is one of the skills you can craft on items so you can get it to a pretty massive level(+4 per item).

It is still ineffective against magic/ranged, but it's very powerful in the right circumstances.

MAYBE if you take all Parry focuses (including improved). I'll add 1 additional Parry able attack. I'll think about that though.

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Jaq



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PostSubject: Re: Parry as a primary skill...   Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:37 am

Highv Priest wrote:
There is actually a +7 leather armor.. The highest AC total armor in the game actually. Additionally while you cannot block all attacks concealment is still a thing and AC is a thing too.

Epic Dodge is also a thing.

Parry is one of the skills you can craft on items so you can get it to a pretty massive level(+4 per item).

It is still ineffective against magic/ranged, but it's very powerful in the right circumstances.

MAYBE if you take all Parry focuses (including improved). I'll add 1 additional Parry able attack. I'll think about that though.


Yea, I've thought about making a monk with epic dodge and self concealment V, but it's rather feat focused so will be hard to get impr. skill focus in there as well.

Oh, afaik, the number af parryable attacks (3) is hard coded and cannot be changed...

Let's see if I can catch you online sometime and we can test it more thoroughly.

Happy New Year,

Jaq
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PostSubject: Re: Parry as a primary skill...   Fri Dec 30, 2016 2:32 pm

Jaq wrote:


Oh, afaik, the number af parryable attacks (3) is hard coded and cannot be changed...
Jaq

There is no such thing as hard coded anymore. Some stuff can't be modified realistically because it makes the game unstable, but Parry is not one of those things.

It would be foolish to make Parry block and counter every attack though as such a build would basically be a hard counter to anything melee and more or less playing with God mode on.
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Jaq



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PostSubject: Re: Parry as a primary skill...   Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:27 pm

Highv Priest wrote:
Jaq wrote:


Oh, afaik, the number af parryable attacks (3) is hard coded and cannot be changed...
Jaq

There is no such thing as hard coded anymore. Some stuff can't be modified realistically because it makes the game unstable, but Parry is not one of those things.

It would be foolish to make Parry block and counter every attack though as such a build would basically be a hard counter to anything melee and more or less playing with God mode on.

You are right parry should not equal god mode, but in it's current state it's utter crap.

I've been testing my parry build against bosses and must say it's a real disaster, here's why:
- Improved parry doesn't work ie. the +4 benefit to riposte attacks isn't working
- The damage buff on a riposte isn't working either or is so miniscule that it's useless
- Parry itself need a buff - I have parry on all my items and sure I can parry three attacks every round, but my riposte attacks never hits anything because my ab is only 55 - Riposte attacks need to buff ab in some way eg. 1/4 of parry skill added as an ab buff.

If parry was to be buffed then it could actually be fun - you would still take hits but your riposte attacks could both hit and hurt bosses.

Would be amazing if a melee build could use parry to go toe to toe with assassin in Newport, instead of using magic or traps to kill that little bugger Wink

Cheers,
Jaq
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PostSubject: Re: Parry as a primary skill...   Mon Jan 16, 2017 6:31 pm

Jaq wrote:

You are right parry should not equal god mode, but in it's current state it's utter crap.

I've been testing my parry build against bosses and must say it's a real disaster, here's why:
- Improved parry doesn't work ie. the +4 benefit to riposte attacks isn't working
- The damage buff on a riposte isn't working either or is so miniscule that it's useless
- Parry itself need a buff - I have parry on all my items and sure I can parry three attacks every round, but my riposte attacks never hits anything because my ab is only 55 - Riposte attacks need to buff ab in some way eg. 1/4 of parry skill added as an ab buff.

If parry was to be buffed then it could actually be fun - you would still take hits but your riposte attacks could both hit and hurt bosses.

Would be amazing if a melee build could use parry to go toe to toe with assassin in Newport, instead of using magic or traps to kill that little bugger Wink

Cheers,
Jaq

Improved Parry is just an additional +4 to the skill, like skill focus, but slightly more.

Correct the damage buff is presently not working, working on fixing that, but it requires modifying the internal structs for damage effects.

1/4 parry skill added to ab is brutally insurmountably high. Breaching 100+ ab would be very easy. Buffing parries ab would also make it essentially the 'block all melee" option.

However I will say if they get all 3 feats for parry I think +4 ab/discipline when activating parry mode would most definitely be warranted.
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